Discussion:
Marching Season
(too old to reply)
Byker
2021-07-11 23:18:31 UTC
Permalink
It's Marchin' Season once again in Ulster.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jul/11/northern-irelands-deputy-leader-urges-calm-before-loyalist-parades
The essentials of redneck culture were brought to America by what we call
the Scots Irish [Ulster Scots], after first being shipped to the Ulster
Plantation, where our remarkable cultural legacy can still be seen
every July 12: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Twelfth

Small wonder my humble ancestors sailed away from all this bullshit 300
years ago...
Dhu on Gate
2021-07-12 02:04:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Byker
It's Marchin' Season once again in Ulster.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jul/11/northern-irelands-deputy-leader-urges-calm-before-loyalist-parades
The essentials of redneck culture were brought to America by what we call
the Scots Irish [Ulster Scots], after first being shipped to the Ulster
Plantation, where our remarkable cultural legacy can still be seen
every July 12: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Twelfth
Small wonder my humble ancestors sailed away from all this bullshit 300
years ago...
I feel similarly: about 2/3 of my ancestry is from around
the north end of the Irish Sea: there are places it's
better to be from than to be ;-)

Dhu
--
Je suis Canadien. Ce n'est pas Francais ou Anglaise.
C'est une esp`ece de sauvage: ne obliviscaris, vix ea nostra voco;-)
Byker
2021-07-12 16:42:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dhu on Gate
Post by Byker
Small wonder my humble ancestors sailed away from all this bullshit 300
years ago...
I feel similarly: about 2/3 of my ancestry is from around
the north end of the Irish Sea: there are places it's
better to be from than to be ;-)
When Bob Ballard found the Titanic in 1985, many authors went in search of
living survivors to interview. Since most were dead, they wound up
interviewing the descendants of those who survived the disaster and settled
down in America. They noted that their children and grandchildren had done
quite well for themselves, becoming businessmen and engineers, doctors and
lawyers, etc. As for the descendants of those who BUILT the Titanic in
Belfast, Northern Ireland, they were stunned to discover that these people
were still living in the same drab, dingy, working-class neighborhoods,
often on the same street, that their grandparents had occupied. So much for
"upward mobility."

So who has it better today, the descendants of those who crossed the pond or
those who stayed behind?
NSquared
2021-07-13 03:11:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Byker
Post by Dhu on Gate
Post by Byker
Small wonder my humble ancestors sailed away from all this bullshit 300
years ago...
I feel similarly: about 2/3 of my ancestry is from around
the north end of the Irish Sea: there are places it's
better to be from than to be ;-)
When Bob Ballard found the Titanic in 1985, many authors went in search of
living survivors to interview.  Since most were dead, they wound up
interviewing the descendants of those who survived the disaster and settled
down in America.  They noted that their children and grandchildren had done
quite well for themselves, becoming businessmen and engineers, doctors and
lawyers, etc.  As for the descendants of those who BUILT the Titanic in
Belfast, Northern Ireland, they were stunned to discover that these people
were still living in the same drab, dingy, working-class neighborhoods,
often on the same street, that their grandparents had occupied. So much for
"upward mobility."
So who has it better today, the descendants of those who crossed the pond or
those who stayed behind?
The UK/Ireland has never had much in the way
of "upward mobility" - by design of their
"betters". The class system is still quite
strong. Everybody has their niche and defends
it against all upstarts. No wonder the Brits
liked India ...
M I Wakefield
2021-07-13 12:03:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by NSquared
The UK/Ireland has never had much in the way
of "upward mobility" - by design of their
"betters". The class system is still quite
strong. Everybody has their niche and defends
it against all upstarts. No wonder the Brits
liked India ...
Britain, with an actual class system, has more class mobility than the
United States.

https://www.visualcapitalist.com/ranked-the-social-mobility-of-82-countries/
JNugent
2021-07-13 16:41:36 UTC
Permalink
"Dhu on Gate"  wrote...
Post by Dhu on Gate
Post by Byker
Small wonder my humble ancestors sailed away from all this bullshit 300
years ago...
I feel similarly: about 2/3 of my ancestry is from around
the north end of the Irish Sea: there are places it's
better to be from than to be ;-)
When Bob Ballard found the Titanic in 1985, many authors went in search of
living survivors to interview.  Since most were dead, they wound up
interviewing the descendants of those who survived the disaster and settled
down in America.  They noted that their children and grandchildren had done
quite well for themselves, becoming businessmen and engineers, doctors and
lawyers, etc.  As for the descendants of those who BUILT the Titanic in
Belfast, Northern Ireland, they were stunned to discover that these people
were still living in the same drab, dingy, working-class neighborhoods,
often on the same street, that their grandparents had occupied. So much for
"upward mobility."
So who has it better today, the descendants of those who crossed the pond or
those who stayed behind?
  The UK/Ireland has never had much in the way
  of "upward mobility" - by design of their
  "betters". The class system is still quite
  strong. Everybody has their niche and defends
  it against all upstarts. No wonder the Brits
  liked India ...
On the contrary, post-WW2, England & Wales had a successful bi-partisan
approach to education, agreed by Parliament in 1944 when the government
was a coalition (with R.A.B. Butler as education minister and Clement
Attlee as deputy Prime Minister for a start).

The Butler Act provided for three types of secondary schools: grammar
schools (continuing a great tradition but widening access so that the
former fees* were not payable and entry was conditional merely upon
ability), technical high schools (more honoured in the breach than the
observance) and secondary modern schools (which might have been better
dubbed "modern secondary schools").

Grammar schools and the technical schools provided access to the UK's
then relatively few universities via the public examination schemes.
Although Scotland didn't have exactly the same system, in practice, it
was similar.

A higher percentage of state school alumni got into Oxford and Cambridge
under that system than does now, after the wrecking of grammar schools
(except in a few places where local politics was conducted in a wiser
than average manner) and the few technical high schools that ever existed.

[* Grammar school fees had often been payable, but not for pupils
winning a scholarship award, hence the continued vernacular use of the
term "scholarship" for the 11+ exam for decades afterwards in some areas.]



[Most x-posted NGs in header deleted.]

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