Discussion:
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity"
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Pamela
2020-01-06 16:01:25 UTC
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"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".

Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?

What improvement, if any, will I notice?
A. Filip
2020-01-06 16:07:08 UTC
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Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Is it legally binding promise? ;-)
--
A. Filip
| Brandy-and-water spoils two good things. (Charles Lamb)
abelard
2020-01-06 16:53:14 UTC
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Post by A. Filip
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Is it legally binding promise? ;-)
all things are relative...

just think, we could have ended up with agent
cob and fascist 'new' labour

anything else is extreme prosperity
--
www.abelard.org
Keema's Nan
2020-01-06 17:00:59 UTC
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Post by abelard
Post by A. Filip
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Is it legally binding promise? ;-)
all things are relative...
just think, we could have ended up with agent
cob and fascist 'new' labour
You couldn’t have.

You don’t even live here.
Post by abelard
anything else is extreme prosperity
Pamela
2020-01-06 17:07:25 UTC
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On 6 Jan 2020, abelard wrote (in
Post by abelard
Post by A. Filip
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Is it legally binding promise? ;-)
all things are relative...
just think, we could have ended up with agent cob and fascist 'new'
labour
You couldn't have.
You don't even live here.
Said he would come back after Tony Blair, but never did. He's been away
so long, he's lost the right to vote in our elections.
abelard
2020-01-06 18:19:55 UTC
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Post by Pamela
On 6 Jan 2020, abelard wrote (in
Post by abelard
Post by A. Filip
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Is it legally binding promise? ;-)
all things are relative...
just think, we could have ended up with agent cob and fascist 'new'
labour
You couldn't have.
You don't even live here.
Said he would come back after Tony Blair,
liar
Post by Pamela
but never did. He's been away
so long, he's lost the right to vote in our elections.
--
www.abelard.org
JNugent
2020-01-06 18:34:57 UTC
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Permalink
Post by A. Filip
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Is it legally binding promise? ;-)
It's only advisory, innit?
Roger
2020-01-07 09:26:34 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by A. Filip
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Is it legally binding promise? ;-)
--
A. Filip
| Brandy-and-water spoils two good things. (Charles Lamb)
Effects of a new government are generally out of phase by at least a year, not least of which because a new budget needs to come in and then take effect. With a spring election it can be more like two years before you could realistically measure any effect.

However in this case things are more complicated. Allthough the UK leaves the EU at the end of January, there is no change until at least 2021. OTOH once a definitive Brexit path has been laid then we should see things 'suspended' started to move as people know what the future is. But a true post Brexit economy and budget cannot enter in force until at least 2021; so I guess it will be 2 years before we can realisticaly draw conclusions.

Mind you, Pammy will have allready made up her mind as she's not bothered about reality; so I guess she can start complaining immediately.
Ophelia
2020-01-07 20:39:59 UTC
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Permalink
Post by A. Filip
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Is it legally binding promise? ;-)
--
A. Filip
| Brandy-and-water spoils two good things. (Charles Lamb)
Effects of a new government are generally out of phase by at least a year,
not least of which because a new budget needs to come in and then take
effect. With a spring election it can be more like two years before you
could realistically measure any effect.

However in this case things are more complicated. Allthough the UK leaves
the EU at the end of January, there is no change until at least 2021. OTOH
once a definitive Brexit path has been laid then we should see things
'suspended' started to move as people know what the future is. But a true
post Brexit economy and budget cannot enter in force until at least 2021; so
I guess it will be 2 years before we can realisticaly draw conclusions.

Mind you, Pammy will have allready made up her mind as she's not bothered
about reality; so I guess she can start complaining immediately.

===

She???
Roger
2020-01-08 06:36:03 UTC
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Permalink
Post by Roger
Post by A. Filip
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Is it legally binding promise? ;-)
--
A. Filip
| Brandy-and-water spoils two good things. (Charles Lamb)
Effects of a new government are generally out of phase by at least a year,
not least of which because a new budget needs to come in and then take
effect. With a spring election it can be more like two years before you
could realistically measure any effect.
However in this case things are more complicated. Allthough the UK leaves
the EU at the end of January, there is no change until at least 2021. OTOH
once a definitive Brexit path has been laid then we should see things
'suspended' started to move as people know what the future is. But a true
post Brexit economy and budget cannot enter in force until at least 2021; so
I guess it will be 2 years before we can realisticaly draw conclusions.
Mind you, Pammy will have allready made up her mind as she's not bothered
about reality; so I guess she can start complaining immediately.
===
She???
I call people by what they identify themselves as.
Ophelia
2020-01-08 21:20:23 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Roger
Post by A. Filip
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Is it legally binding promise? ;-)
--
A. Filip
| Brandy-and-water spoils two good things. (Charles Lamb)
Effects of a new government are generally out of phase by at least a year,
not least of which because a new budget needs to come in and then take
effect. With a spring election it can be more like two years before you
could realistically measure any effect.
However in this case things are more complicated. Allthough the UK leaves
the EU at the end of January, there is no change until at least 2021. OTOH
once a definitive Brexit path has been laid then we should see things
'suspended' started to move as people know what the future is. But a true
post Brexit economy and budget cannot enter in force until at least 2021; so
I guess it will be 2 years before we can realisticaly draw conclusions.
Mind you, Pammy will have allready made up her mind as she's not bothered
about reality; so I guess she can start complaining immediately.
===
She???
I call people by what they identify themselves as.

==

Righteo:)
Pamela
2020-01-09 11:30:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Roger
Post by A. Filip
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Is it legally binding promise? ;-)
-- A. Filip
| Brandy-and-water spoils two good things. (Charles Lamb)
Effects of a new government are generally out of phase by at least a
year, not least of which because a new budget needs to come in and then
take effect. With a spring election it can be more like two years before
you could realistically measure any effect.
However in this case things are more complicated. Allthough the UK
leaves the EU at the end of January, there is no change until at least
2021. OTOH once a definitive Brexit path has been laid then we should
see things 'suspended' started to move as people know what the future
is. But a true post Brexit economy and budget cannot enter in force
until at least 2021; so I guess it will be 2 years before we can
realisticaly draw conclusions.
Mind you, Pammy will have allready made up her mind as she's not
bothered about reality; so I guess she can start complaining
immediately.
===
She???
I call people by what they identify themselves as.

==

Righteo:)

==

Righteo:)
Pamela
2020-01-08 15:13:53 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Roger
Post by A. Filip
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Is it legally binding promise? ;-)
--
A. Filip
| Brandy-and-water spoils two good things. (Charles Lamb)
Effects of a new government are generally out of phase by at least a
year, not least of which because a new budget needs to come in and then
take effect. With a spring election it can be more like two years before
you could realistically measure any effect.
However in this case things are more complicated. Allthough the UK
leaves the EU at the end of January, there is no change until at least
2021. OTOH once a definitive Brexit path has been laid then we should
see things 'suspended' started to move as people know what the future
is. But a true post Brexit economy and budget cannot enter in force
until at least 2021; so I guess it will be 2 years before we can
realisticaly draw conclusions.
Mind you, Pammy will have allready made up her mind as she's not
bothered about reality; so I guess she can start complaining
immediately.
===
She???
You might be male Ophelia, but I am not.
CheeseySock
2020-01-06 21:49:11 UTC
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Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
depends if you are one of boris' set!
Paul Elam
2020-01-07 10:11:33 UTC
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Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Johnson was born in New York and was a US citizen until the IRS chased
him for unpaid taxes.
Roger
2020-01-07 10:39:24 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Paul Elam
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Johnson was born in New York and was a US citizen until the IRS chased
him for unpaid taxes.
He was 3 months old when he left the US; how did he run up a tax bill?
Farmer Giles
2020-01-07 10:50:25 UTC
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Permalink
Post by Roger
Post by Paul Elam
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Johnson was born in New York and was a US citizen until the IRS chased
him for unpaid taxes.
He was 3 months old when he left the US; how did he run up a tax bill?
Is is not the case that US citizens are required to pay US taxes
wherever they earn their money?
Roger
2020-01-07 10:58:02 UTC
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Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Roger
Post by Paul Elam
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Johnson was born in New York and was a US citizen until the IRS chased
him for unpaid taxes.
He was 3 months old when he left the US; how did he run up a tax bill?
Is is not the case that US citizens are required to pay US taxes
wherever they earn their money?
So how does that work with PAYE?
Farmer Giles
2020-01-07 14:05:18 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Roger
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Roger
Post by Paul Elam
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Johnson was born in New York and was a US citizen until the IRS chased
him for unpaid taxes.
He was 3 months old when he left the US; how did he run up a tax bill?
Is is not the case that US citizens are required to pay US taxes
wherever they earn their money?
So how does that work with PAYE?
I have no idea.


https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/taxpayers-living-abroad
Maxwell Boltzmann
2020-01-07 18:34:23 UTC
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Post by Roger
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Roger
Post by Paul Elam
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Johnson was born in New York and was a US citizen until the IRS chased
him for unpaid taxes.
He was 3 months old when he left the US; how did he run up a tax bill?
Is is not the case that US citizens are required to pay US taxes
wherever they earn their money?
So how does that work with PAYE?
HMRC collect the individual's UK income tax liability, and gives him a
statement that they have done so. When he submits his US income tax
return, he can set this amount off against his US tax bill.

This "foreign tax credit" system is widely used where jurisdictions have
double taxation treaties with one another, but is particularly important
where the US is concerned because of its worldwide taxation system.

Johnson's problems were to do with capital gains tax not income tax,
because the USA imposes CGT on some asset disposals which are not taxed
in the UK; notably the principal private residence.
--
Max
Roger
2020-01-08 06:44:34 UTC
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Post by Maxwell Boltzmann
Post by Roger
So how does that work with PAYE?
HMRC collect the individual's UK income tax liability, and gives him a
statement that they have done so. When he submits his US income tax
return, he can set this amount off against his US tax bill.
This "foreign tax credit" system is widely used where jurisdictions have
double taxation treaties with one another, but is particularly important
where the US is concerned because of its worldwide taxation system.
Johnson's problems were to do with capital gains tax not income tax,
because the USA imposes CGT on some asset disposals which are not taxed
in the UK; notably the principal private residence.
--
Max
Right; so Johnson was liable for CGT in the USA on the sale of his house in the UK, was chased by the IRS for non payment who cancelled his citizenship?

Seems a bit harsh, but little would suprise me with the US of today :D
Pamela
2020-01-08 15:16:46 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Roger
Post by Maxwell Boltzmann
Post by Roger
So how does that work with PAYE?
HMRC collect the individual's UK income tax liability, and gives him a
statement that they have done so. When he submits his US income tax
return, he can set this amount off against his US tax bill.
This "foreign tax credit" system is widely used where jurisdictions
have double taxation treaties with one another, but is particularly
important where the US is concerned because of its worldwide taxation
system.
Johnson's problems were to do with capital gains tax not income tax,
because the USA imposes CGT on some asset disposals which are not taxed
in the UK; notably the principal private residence.
--
Max
Right; so Johnson was liable for CGT in the USA on the sale of his house
in the UK, was chased by the IRS for non payment who cancelled his
citizenship?
Boris cancelled his US citzenship shortly before the referendum because would
make him look more British.
Post by Roger
Seems a bit harsh, but little would suprise me with the US of today :D
Vidcapper
2020-01-08 07:13:37 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Paul Elam
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Johnson was born in New York and was a US citizen until the IRS chased
him for unpaid taxes.
His family left the US when he was only 5, so the 'unpaid taxes' part is
clearly bullshit!
--
Paul Hyett, Cheltenham
Farmer Giles
2020-01-08 07:40:31 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Vidcapper
Post by Paul Elam
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Johnson was born in New York and was a US citizen until the IRS chased
him for unpaid taxes.
His family left the US when he was only 5, so the 'unpaid taxes' part is
clearly bullshit!
Even though you would know all about bullshit, you clearly know nothing
about the world-wide liabilities of the US tax system.
tim...
2020-01-08 08:53:33 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Vidcapper
Post by Paul Elam
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Johnson was born in New York and was a US citizen until the IRS chased
him for unpaid taxes.
His family left the US when he was only 5,
this give him US citizenship
Post by Vidcapper
so the 'unpaid taxes' part is clearly bullshit!
as a US citizen he has a liability to US taxes on his worldwide income
Post by Vidcapper
--
Paul Hyett, Cheltenham
Vidcapper
2020-01-09 06:56:38 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by tim...
Post by Vidcapper
Post by Paul Elam
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Johnson was born in New York and was a US citizen until the IRS chased
him for unpaid taxes.
His family left the US when he was only 5,
this give him US citizenship
Post by Vidcapper
so the 'unpaid taxes' part is clearly bullshit!
as a US citizen he has a liability to US taxes on his worldwide income
When he was 5??

Also, he is a *British* citizen now.
--
Paul Hyett, Cheltenham
Farmer Giles
2020-01-09 07:07:01 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Vidcapper
Post by tim...
Post by Vidcapper
Post by Paul Elam
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Johnson was born in New York and was a US citizen until the IRS chased
him for unpaid taxes.
His family left the US when he was only 5,
this give him US citizenship
Post by Vidcapper
so the 'unpaid taxes' part is clearly bullshit!
as a US citizen he has a liability to US taxes on his worldwide income
When he was 5??
Also, he is a *British* citizen now.
Look things up instead of making an even bigger fool of yourself.
Roger
2020-01-09 08:20:39 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Vidcapper
Post by tim...
Post by Vidcapper
Post by Paul Elam
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Johnson was born in New York and was a US citizen until the IRS chased
him for unpaid taxes.
His family left the US when he was only 5,
this give him US citizenship
Post by Vidcapper
so the 'unpaid taxes' part is clearly bullshit!
as a US citizen he has a liability to US taxes on his worldwide income
When he was 5??
Also, he is a *British* citizen now.
Look things up instead of making an even bigger fool of yourself.
Not making head or tails of this I have looked it up.

He was born in New York as his father was at Columbia University, but they moved back to the UK soon after as his mother was starting at Oxford. He then returned to the US between the ages of 2 and 5 as his father (an economist) was working at the World Bank.

He had dual citizenship so he was liable to pay tax in the USA, but not for the tax he has allready paid on his in income in the UK.

When selling his house in the UK, which had increased in value, he became liable for CGT in the US, but not in the UK as it was his 1st home etc. So the IRS chased him for the tax, which he contested but eventually paid up.

He then renounced his US citizenship, which apparently he said he did for patriotic reasons. Of course he may have done it avoid further beurocracy. Quite possibily both.

Either way, the original post from 'Paul Elam' was pretty misleading, more fool me for believing it vertabim ;-)

Along the way I also discovered that had gone to Eton with a Scholarship and prior to that he had attened the European School in Brussels whilst his father was working for the European commision.
Farmer Giles
2020-01-09 08:32:34 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Roger
Post by Farmer Giles
Post by Vidcapper
Post by tim...
Post by Vidcapper
Post by Paul Elam
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Johnson was born in New York and was a US citizen until the IRS chased
him for unpaid taxes.
His family left the US when he was only 5,
this give him US citizenship
Post by Vidcapper
so the 'unpaid taxes' part is clearly bullshit!
as a US citizen he has a liability to US taxes on his worldwide income
When he was 5??
Also, he is a *British* citizen now.
Look things up instead of making an even bigger fool of yourself.
Not making head or tails of this I have looked it up.
He was born in New York as his father was at Columbia University, but they moved back to the UK soon after as his mother was starting at Oxford. He then returned to the US between the ages of 2 and 5 as his father (an economist) was working at the World Bank.
He had dual citizenship so he was liable to pay tax in the USA, but not for the tax he has allready paid on his in income in the UK.
When selling his house in the UK, which had increased in value, he became liable for CGT in the US, but not in the UK as it was his 1st home etc. So the IRS chased him for the tax, which he contested but eventually paid up.
He then renounced his US citizenship, which apparently he said he did for patriotic reasons. Of course he may have done it avoid further beurocracy. Quite possibily both.
Either way, the original post from 'Paul Elam' was pretty misleading, more fool me for believing it vertabim ;-)
Along the way I also discovered that had gone to Eton with a Scholarship and prior to that he had attened the European School in Brussels whilst his father was working for the European commision.
I agree with you that it's not clear exactly why he renounced his US
citizenship - although it's hard to imagine why someone completely
settled in the UK would bother with dual nationality given the tax
liability complications that could ensue in doing so.
Vidcapper
2020-01-09 14:33:49 UTC
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Permalink
Post by Farmer Giles
Look things up instead of making an even bigger fool of yourself.
I bow to the expert at that... :)
--
Paul Hyett, Cheltenham
abelard
2020-01-09 15:07:32 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Vidcapper
Post by Farmer Giles
Look things up instead of making an even bigger fool of yourself.
I bow to the expert at that... :)
you give him too much credit...his 'expertise' is neither
deliberate nor considered...

to admire fellow for being tall or short is an achievement
of nature...not of personal merit or effort or struggle
--
www.abelard.org
Farmer Giles
2020-01-09 17:08:40 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by abelard
Post by Vidcapper
Post by Farmer Giles
Look things up instead of making an even bigger fool of yourself.
I bow to the expert at that... :)
you give him too much credit...his 'expertise' is neither
deliberate nor considered...
to admire fellow for being tall or short is an achievement
of nature...not of personal merit or effort or struggle
"I ask you to judge me by the enemies I have made."

Frankin D Roosevelt.
Farmer Giles
2020-01-09 17:05:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Vidcapper
Post by Farmer Giles
Look things up instead of making an even bigger fool of yourself.
I bow to the expert at that... :)
In which case you must be looking in the mirror.
JNugent
2020-01-09 17:39:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Vidcapper
Post by tim...
Post by Vidcapper
Post by Paul Elam
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Johnson was born in New York and was a US citizen until the IRS chased
him for unpaid taxes.
His family left the US when he was only 5,
this give him US citizenship
Post by Vidcapper
so the 'unpaid taxes' part is clearly bullshit!
as a US citizen he has a liability to US taxes on his worldwide income
When he was 5??
Also, he is a *British* citizen now.
Boris has been a British citizen since birth. The fact that he was also
a natural born American citizen does not detract from that.
Pamela
2020-01-08 15:09:10 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Vidcapper
Post by Paul Elam
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Johnson was born in New York and was a US citizen until the IRS chased
him for unpaid taxes.
His family left the US when he was only 5, so the 'unpaid taxes' part is
clearly bullshit!
The tax liability is not calculated as of the time of leaving. Surely a few
minutes on Goolge can tell you that.
Pent
2020-01-07 10:59:43 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Like his promise to increase police and nurse numbers it will not even
cover what was lost during austerity.
Roger
2020-01-07 11:11:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pent
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Like his promise to increase police and nurse numbers it will not even
cover what was lost during austerity.
Well at least we should know about that in March when we see his first Budget.
Pamela
2020-01-07 11:37:37 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pent
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Like his promise to increase police and nurse numbers it will not even
cover what was lost during austerity.
Boris said he was going to magic up 40 new hospitals.
tim...
2020-01-07 12:30:25 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pamela
Post by Pent
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Like his promise to increase police and nurse numbers it will not even
cover what was lost during austerity.
Boris said he was going to magic up 40 new hospitals.
no he didn't

He did no more than every other prospective candidate does

promise stuff that at some point in the future might materialise

As I have pointed out before, Wilson won the 1966 Hull by-election by
promising the Humber bridge

that was magiced up in 1981, long after Wilson was out of power

tim
Keema's Nan
2020-01-07 13:29:55 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by tim...
Post by Pamela
Post by Pent
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Like his promise to increase police and nurse numbers it will not even
cover what was lost during austerity.
Boris said he was going to magic up 40 new hospitals.
no he didn't
He did no more than every other prospective candidate does
promise stuff that at some point in the future might materialise
As I have pointed out before, Wilson won the 1966 Hull by-election by
promising the Humber bridge
Wilson also promised to reverse the Beeching railway closures, and then when
in power did no such thing.
Post by tim...
that was magiced up in 1981, long after Wilson was out of power
tim
They are all lying toe-rags, and yet the sheep still seem hypnotised by their
every word.
abelard
2020-01-07 14:00:20 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 07 Jan 2020 13:29:55 +0000, Keema's Nan
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
Post by Pamela
Post by Pent
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Like his promise to increase police and nurse numbers it will not even
cover what was lost during austerity.
Boris said he was going to magic up 40 new hospitals.
no he didn't
He did no more than every other prospective candidate does
promise stuff that at some point in the future might materialise
As I have pointed out before, Wilson won the 1966 Hull by-election by
promising the Humber bridge
Wilson also promised to reverse the Beeching railway closures, and then when
in power did no such thing.
at least he always told you when he was going to lie

he always started with, 'to be perfectly frank and honest'


now every socialist liar still starts with 'to be honest'

but even now the pound in your pocket is still worth at least 5 1/2p
--
www.abelard.org
Keema's Nan
2020-01-07 14:05:52 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by abelard
On Tue, 07 Jan 2020 13:29:55 +0000, Keema's Nan
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
Post by Pamela
Post by Pent
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st
January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Like his promise to increase police and nurse numbers it will not even
cover what was lost during austerity.
Boris said he was going to magic up 40 new hospitals.
no he didn't
He did no more than every other prospective candidate does
promise stuff that at some point in the future might materialise
As I have pointed out before, Wilson won the 1966 Hull by-election by
promising the Humber bridge
Wilson also promised to reverse the Beeching railway closures, and then when
in power did no such thing.
at least he always told you when he was going to lie
he always started with, 'to be perfectly frank and honest'
now every socialist liar still starts with 'to be honest'
but even now the pound in your pocket is still worth at least 5 1/2p
Yes, and Heath didn’t even bother with trying to do anything he promised,
but just said “there are no quick and easy answers” and yet every Tory
since then has pretended they have the quick and easy answers.

But, who was it who used to shout in the middle of the night:-

“ Bring me a small boy! ”.
Ian Jackson
2020-01-07 16:05:39 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
Post by Pamela
Post by Pent
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Like his promise to increase police and nurse numbers it will not even
cover what was lost during austerity.
Boris said he was going to magic up 40 new hospitals.
no he didn't
He did no more than every other prospective candidate does
promise stuff that at some point in the future might materialise
As I have pointed out before, Wilson won the 1966 Hull by-election by
promising the Humber bridge
Wilson also promised to reverse the Beeching railway closures, and then when
in power did no such thing.
He had probably overlooked the fact that many of the closed lines had
been ripped up, some of the bridges they crossed demolished - and in
some locations buildings and roads constructed across their path.
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
that was magiced up in 1981, long after Wilson was out of power
tim
They are all lying toe-rags, and yet the sheep still seem hypnotised by their
every word.
Certainly 17.4 million succumbed to the promises about Brexit.
--
Ian
Roger
2020-01-08 06:55:33 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
Post by Pamela
Post by Pent
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st
January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Like his promise to increase police and nurse numbers it will not even
cover what was lost during austerity.
Boris said he was going to magic up 40 new hospitals.
no he didn't
He did no more than every other prospective candidate does
promise stuff that at some point in the future might materialise
As I have pointed out before, Wilson won the 1966 Hull by-election by
promising the Humber bridge
Wilson also promised to reverse the Beeching railway closures, and then when
in power did no such thing.
He had probably overlooked the fact that many of the closed lines had
been ripped up, some of the bridges they crossed demolished - and in
some locations buildings and roads constructed across their path.
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
that was magiced up in 1981, long after Wilson was out of power
tim
They are all lying toe-rags, and yet the sheep still seem hypnotised by their
every word.
Certainly 17.4 million succumbed to the promises about Brexit.
--
Ian
Just so we can get this on record, which are the promises which you believe people 'Succumbed' to which you believe will not be met?
Ian Jackson
2020-01-08 07:31:58 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Roger
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
Post by Pamela
Post by Pent
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st
January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Like his promise to increase police and nurse numbers it will not even
cover what was lost during austerity.
Boris said he was going to magic up 40 new hospitals.
no he didn't
He did no more than every other prospective candidate does
promise stuff that at some point in the future might materialise
As I have pointed out before, Wilson won the 1966 Hull by-election by
promising the Humber bridge
Wilson also promised to reverse the Beeching railway closures, and then when
in power did no such thing.
He had probably overlooked the fact that many of the closed lines had
been ripped up, some of the bridges they crossed demolished - and in
some locations buildings and roads constructed across their path.
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
that was magiced up in 1981, long after Wilson was out of power
tim
They are all lying toe-rags, and yet the sheep still seem hypnotised by their
every word.
Certainly 17.4 million succumbed to the promises about Brexit.
--
Ian
Just so we can get this on record, which are the promises which you
believe people 'Succumbed' to which you believe will not be met?
Well, I doubt if there will be any sunlit uplands and unicorns.
--
Ian
Roger
2020-01-08 07:47:56 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Roger
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
Post by Pamela
Post by Pent
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st
January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Like his promise to increase police and nurse numbers it will not even
cover what was lost during austerity.
Boris said he was going to magic up 40 new hospitals.
no he didn't
He did no more than every other prospective candidate does
promise stuff that at some point in the future might materialise
As I have pointed out before, Wilson won the 1966 Hull by-election by
promising the Humber bridge
Wilson also promised to reverse the Beeching railway closures, and then when
in power did no such thing.
He had probably overlooked the fact that many of the closed lines had
been ripped up, some of the bridges they crossed demolished - and in
some locations buildings and roads constructed across their path.
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
that was magiced up in 1981, long after Wilson was out of power
tim
They are all lying toe-rags, and yet the sheep still seem hypnotised by their
every word.
Certainly 17.4 million succumbed to the promises about Brexit.
--
Ian
Just so we can get this on record, which are the promises which you
believe people 'Succumbed' to which you believe will not be met?
Well, I doubt if there will be any sunlit uplands and unicorns.
You doubt? I think most level headed people are absolutely sure there won't be 'sunlit uplands and unicorns'. What does this have to do with the question?
Ian Jackson
2020-01-08 08:18:42 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Roger
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Roger
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
Post by Pamela
Post by Pent
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st
January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Like his promise to increase police and nurse numbers it will not even
cover what was lost during austerity.
Boris said he was going to magic up 40 new hospitals.
no he didn't
He did no more than every other prospective candidate does
promise stuff that at some point in the future might materialise
As I have pointed out before, Wilson won the 1966 Hull by-election by
promising the Humber bridge
Wilson also promised to reverse the Beeching railway closures, and then when
in power did no such thing.
He had probably overlooked the fact that many of the closed lines had
been ripped up, some of the bridges they crossed demolished - and in
some locations buildings and roads constructed across their path.
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
that was magiced up in 1981, long after Wilson was out of power
tim
They are all lying toe-rags, and yet the sheep still seem hypnotised by their
every word.
Certainly 17.4 million succumbed to the promises about Brexit.
--
Ian
Just so we can get this on record, which are the promises which you
believe people 'Succumbed' to which you believe will not be met?
Well, I doubt if there will be any sunlit uplands and unicorns.
You doubt? I think most level headed people are absolutely sure there
won't be 'sunlit uplands and unicorns'. What does this have to do with
the question?
OK - what about the return of coalmining* to County Durham, and
shipbuilding to Wearside (like that guy in Sunderland looks forward to)?
*Actually, I have to admit that such things are not totally impossible.
Despite protests, a new deep coalmine in Cumbria has been given the
go-ahead.
https://tinyurl.com/ygczyrdm
--
Ian
Roger
2020-01-08 09:44:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Roger
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Roger
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
Post by Pamela
Post by Pent
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st
January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Like his promise to increase police and nurse numbers it
will not even
cover what was lost during austerity.
Boris said he was going to magic up 40 new hospitals.
no he didn't
He did no more than every other prospective candidate does
promise stuff that at some point in the future might materialise
As I have pointed out before, Wilson won the 1966 Hull by-election by
promising the Humber bridge
Wilson also promised to reverse the Beeching railway closures, and then when
in power did no such thing.
He had probably overlooked the fact that many of the closed lines had
been ripped up, some of the bridges they crossed demolished - and in
some locations buildings and roads constructed across their path.
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
that was magiced up in 1981, long after Wilson was out of power
tim
They are all lying toe-rags, and yet the sheep still seem hypnotised by their
every word.
Certainly 17.4 million succumbed to the promises about Brexit.
--
Ian
Just so we can get this on record, which are the promises which you
believe people 'Succumbed' to which you believe will not be met?
Well, I doubt if there will be any sunlit uplands and unicorns.
You doubt? I think most level headed people are absolutely sure there
won't be 'sunlit uplands and unicorns'. What does this have to do with
the question?
OK - what about the return of coalmining* to County Durham, and
shipbuilding to Wearside (like that guy in Sunderland looks forward to)?
You were reffering to 17.5 million people, now you are quoting 'some man is the street who was interviewed on the telly'.

BTW, polls and scientific study suggest ‘sovereignty' was the prime motivation for people voting Brexit.
Post by Ian Jackson
*Actually, I have to admit that such things are not totally impossible.
Despite protests, a new deep coalmine in Cumbria has been given the
go-ahead.
The coal mine is for specialist coking coal, a niche product.

I see no particalar reason why there could not be an increase in shipbuilding. There is quite a lot of large commercial shipbuilding, particularly cruise ships, going on in France and Italy were costs and taxes are notoriously high.

Having said that, I don't actually recall any politcal groups promising such things (maybe you are getting miced up with Trump?), so as such it's not really valid for the argument.

Perhaps the most radical things that WAS promised by brexiters in the NE was a freeport to serve the Chemical and Oil industries. Maybe you think that is a Unicorn?
Keema's Nan
2020-01-08 10:03:18 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Roger
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Roger
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Roger
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
Post by Pamela
Post by Pent
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st
January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Like his promise to increase police and nurse numbers it
will not even
cover what was lost during austerity.
Boris said he was going to magic up 40 new hospitals.
no he didn't
He did no more than every other prospective candidate does
promise stuff that at some point in the future might materialise
As I have pointed out before, Wilson won the 1966 Hull by-election by
promising the Humber bridge
Wilson also promised to reverse the Beeching railway closures,
and then when
in power did no such thing.
He had probably overlooked the fact that many of the closed lines had
been ripped up, some of the bridges they crossed demolished - and in
some locations buildings and roads constructed across their path.
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
that was magiced up in 1981, long after Wilson was out of power
tim
They are all lying toe-rags, and yet the sheep still seem hypnotised
by their
every word.
Certainly 17.4 million succumbed to the promises about Brexit.
--
Ian
Just so we can get this on record, which are the promises which you
believe people 'Succumbed' to which you believe will not be met?
Well, I doubt if there will be any sunlit uplands and unicorns.
You doubt? I think most level headed people are absolutely sure there
won't be 'sunlit uplands and unicorns'. What does this have to do with
the question?
OK - what about the return of coalmining* to County Durham, and
shipbuilding to Wearside (like that guy in Sunderland looks forward to)?
You were reffering to 17.5 million people, now you are quoting 'some man is
the street who was interviewed on the telly'.
BTW, polls and scientific study suggest ‘sovereignty' was the prime
motivation for people voting Brexit.
Post by Ian Jackson
*Actually, I have to admit that such things are not totally impossible.
Despite protests, a new deep coalmine in Cumbria has been given the
go-ahead.
The coal mine is for specialist coking coal, a niche product.
I see no particalar reason why there could not be an increase in
shipbuilding. There is quite a lot of large commercial shipbuilding,
particularly cruise ships, going on in France and Italy were costs and taxes
are notoriously high.
Having said that, I don't actually recall any politcal groups promising such
things (maybe you are getting miced up with Trump?), so as such it's not
really valid for the argument.
Perhaps the most radical things that WAS promised by brexiters in the NE was
a freeport to serve the Chemical and Oil industries. Maybe you think that is
a Unicorn?
I don’t think there would be many volunteers to get miced up with Trump.

He seems to never get rat-arsed either.
Ian Jackson
2020-01-08 10:28:35 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Keema's Nan
I don’t think there would be many volunteers to get miced up with Trump.
He seems to never get rat-arsed either.
IIRC, his brother drank himself to death - and as a result, he's an
avowed teetotaller.
--
Ian
Pamela
2020-01-08 15:21:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Ian Jackson
I don't think there would be many volunteers to get miced up with
Trump.
He seems to never get rat-arsed either.
IIRC, his brother drank himself to death - and as a result, he's an
avowed teetotaller.
Trump must have some other vice to account for his addled sentences.
Ian Jackson
2020-01-08 10:25:55 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Roger
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Roger
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Roger
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
Post by Pamela
Post by Pent
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK
January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Like his promise to increase police and nurse numbers it
will not even
cover what was lost during austerity.
Boris said he was going to magic up 40 new hospitals.
no he didn't
He did no more than every other prospective candidate does
promise stuff that at some point in the future might materialise
As I have pointed out before, Wilson won the 1966 Hull by-election by
promising the Humber bridge
Wilson also promised to reverse the Beeching railway closures,
and then when
in power did no such thing.
He had probably overlooked the fact that many of the closed lines had
been ripped up, some of the bridges they crossed demolished - and in
some locations buildings and roads constructed across their path.
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
that was magiced up in 1981, long after Wilson was out of power
tim
They are all lying toe-rags, and yet the sheep still seem hypnotised
by their
every word.
Certainly 17.4 million succumbed to the promises about Brexit.
--
Ian
Just so we can get this on record, which are the promises which you
believe people 'Succumbed' to which you believe will not be met?
Well, I doubt if there will be any sunlit uplands and unicorns.
You doubt? I think most level headed people are absolutely sure there
won't be 'sunlit uplands and unicorns'. What does this have to do with
the question?
OK - what about the return of coalmining* to County Durham, and
shipbuilding to Wearside (like that guy in Sunderland looks forward to)?
You were reffering to 17.5 million people, now you are quoting 'some
man is the street who was interviewed on the telly'.
BTW, polls and scientific study suggest ‘sovereignty' was the prime
motivation for people voting Brexit.
Post by Ian Jackson
*Actually, I have to admit that such things are not totally impossible.
Despite protests, a new deep coalmine in Cumbria has been given the
go-ahead.
The coal mine is for specialist coking coal, a niche product.
IIRC, the mines on S Wales produced a lot of anthracite, which was
necessary to make coke (especially for the steel industry). From what
I've seen on TV, the new mine is going to be a world away from the
'traditional' sort of dark satanic mines from the late 19th and most of
the 20th century, And even for ordinary coal, I understand that modern
methods of burning it produce far fewer pollutants than in the past.
Post by Roger
I see no particalar reason why there could not be an increase in
shipbuilding. There is quite a lot of large commercial shipbuilding,
particularly cruise ships, going on in France and Italy were costs and
taxes are notoriously high.
But if their EU membership hasn't been a drawback to these industries,
why has it been blamed for the demise of so much in the UK?
Post by Roger
Having said that, I don't actually recall any politcal groups promising
such things (maybe you are getting miced up with Trump?), so as such
it's not really valid for the argument.
I don't recall many pro-Brexit advocates promising much that was very
specific. Most of the promised benefits have been necessarily pretty
vague, leaving it up to the recipients to make their own interpretation
of what the specifics might be.
Post by Roger
Perhaps the most radical things that WAS promised by brexiters in the
NE was a freeport to serve the Chemical and Oil industries. Maybe you
think that is a Unicorn?
Presumably such industries will now be able to receive unfettered
government subsidies? Well, if it does come about, and the area thrives
once again, even the most dedicated Remainers will agree that this, in
itself, will be a Good Thing. But who knows whether there will be a
down-side, and what it might be?
--
Ian
Roger
2020-01-08 10:44:37 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Ian Jackson
IIRC, the mines on S Wales produced a lot of anthracite, which was
necessary to make coke (especially for the steel industry). From what
I've seen on TV, the new mine is going to be a world away from the
'traditional' sort of dark satanic mines from the late 19th and most of
the 20th century, And even for ordinary coal, I understand that modern
methods of burning it produce far fewer pollutants than in the past.
Modern coal fired power stations can remove Sulpher (then sold on as an industrial product/fertilizer) which removes smell and prevents acid rain. However it's carbon footprint is the same as any fossil fuel.
Post by Ian Jackson
But if their EU membership hasn't been a drawback to these industries,
why has it been blamed for the demise of so much in the UK?
It isn't. The demise of shipbuilding was blamed on Thatcher and/or the Unions. Either way, the government di not want to modernise the industry to take it towards 'value added' ships rather than large but simple bulk carriers etc.
Post by Ian Jackson
I don't recall many pro-Brexit advocates promising much that was very
specific.
Post by Roger
Perhaps the most radical things that WAS promised by brexiters in the
NE was a freeport to serve the Chemical and Oil industries. Maybe you
think that is a Unicorn?
Presumably such industries will now be able to receive unfettered
government subsidies?
They don't need them, they are doing well:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_East_of_England_Process_Industry_Cluster

but they say with a Freeport they will do better.
Ian Jackson
2020-01-08 15:28:59 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Roger
Post by Ian Jackson
IIRC, the mines on S Wales produced a lot of anthracite, which was
necessary to make coke (especially for the steel industry). From what
I've seen on TV, the new mine is going to be a world away from the
'traditional' sort of dark satanic mines from the late 19th and most of
the 20th century, And even for ordinary coal, I understand that modern
methods of burning it produce far fewer pollutants than in the past.
Modern coal fired power stations can remove Sulpher (then sold on as an
industrial product/fertilizer) which removes smell and prevents acid
rain. However it's carbon footprint is the same as any fossil fuel.
I believe that the intention is that the future use of coal will
increasingly be directed (and restricted) to where there are no
realistic alternatives. As a result, the carbon footprint will be
minimised (but not eliminated).
Post by Roger
Post by Ian Jackson
But if their EU membership hasn't been a drawback to these industries,
why has it been blamed for the demise of so much in the UK?
It isn't. The demise of shipbuilding was blamed on Thatcher and/or the
Unions. Either way, the government di not want to modernise the
industry to take it towards 'value added' ships rather than large but
simple bulk carriers etc.
Post by Ian Jackson
I don't recall many pro-Brexit advocates promising much that was very
specific.
Post by Roger
Perhaps the most radical things that WAS promised by brexiters in the
NE was a freeport to serve the Chemical and Oil industries. Maybe you
think that is a Unicorn?
Presumably such industries will now be able to receive unfettered
government subsidies?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_East_of_England_Process_Industry_Cluster
If the NE is doing pretty well at the moment, why is it seen as a
relatively deprived area - especially by those who were persuaded to
vote leave?
Post by Roger
but they say with a Freeport they will do better.
Industry has been largely anti-Brexit (even in the NE) - so who are the
ones who have been pushing so hard to risk leaving the EU in order to do
better than they are at the moment? While many 'men-in-the-street' were
certainly dissatisfied with their lot, it's unlikely that they were the
instigators of the move to leave the EU and set up a freeport.
--
Ian
Roger
2020-01-08 20:19:26 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Roger
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_East_of_England_Process_Industry_Cluster
If the NE is doing pretty well at the moment, why is it seen as a
relatively deprived area - especially by those who were persuaded to
vote leave?
The NE is struggling. The Chemical pole is one of the bright spots. That's why it make sense to help it. It's not rocket science.
Post by Ian Jackson
Industry has been largely anti-Brexit (even in the NE) - so who are the
ones who have been pushing so hard to risk leaving the EU in order to do
better than they are at the moment? While many 'men-in-the-street' were
certainly dissatisfied with their lot, it's unlikely that they were the
instigators of the move to leave the EU and set up a freeport.
Well this man on the street also happens to run the docks:

"We strongly believe a Free Port covering the region’s advanced manufacturing cluster and key transport nodes like the Port of Tyne has the potential to supercharge regional growth by unlocking post-Brexit opportunities in new and existing supply chains.”

– Matt Beeton, Port of Tyne


And here is Labors's take on it:

Redcar Labour MP Anna Turley said: "Teesport is integral to Teesside’s manufacturing complex and freeport status could deliver a welcome boost to help us remain competitive and an attractive place to do business."

This article in the spectator was written by the president of the Adam Smith institute:

https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/a-global-free-trading-britain-should-back-free-ports/


And this article in Accountancy Daily introduces the concept in the UK in general:

https://www.accountancydaily.co/post-brexit-trade-policy-will-introduce-uk-freeports


But not everybody is favorable, this article thinks it's all about tax evasion and money laundering:

https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/freeports-in-post-brexit-britain-1-6171319

Any which way, the man-in-the-street that you keep referring to is just happy to try something new and is prepared to take the risk.
Ian Jackson
2020-01-09 15:04:27 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Roger
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Roger
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_East_of_England_Process_Industry_Cluster
If the NE is doing pretty well at the moment, why is it seen as a
relatively deprived area - especially by those who were persuaded to
vote leave?
The NE is struggling. The Chemical pole is one of the bright spots.
That's why it make sense to help it. It's not rocket science.
Post by Ian Jackson
Industry has been largely anti-Brexit (even in the NE) - so who are the
ones who have been pushing so hard to risk leaving the EU in order to do
better than they are at the moment? While many 'men-in-the-street' were
certainly dissatisfied with their lot, it's unlikely that they were the
instigators of the move to leave the EU and set up a freeport.
"We strongly believe a Free Port covering the region’s advanced
manufacturing cluster and key transport nodes like the Port of Tyne has
the potential to supercharge regional growth by unlocking post-Brexit
opportunities in new and existing supply chains.”
– Matt Beeton, Port of Tyne
Redcar Labour MP Anna Turley said: "Teesport is integral to
Teesside’s manufacturing complex and freeport status could deliver a
welcome boost to help us remain competitive and an attractive place to
do business."
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/08/a-global-free-trading-britain-shou
ld-back-free-ports/
https://www.accountancydaily.co/post-brexit-trade-policy-will-introduce-
uk-freeports
Neither article really goes into much detail about how a freeport really
works - and other than loads of new jobs, what the advantages are over
normal manufacturing and trading in a regulated economy. It all seems
rather speculative, and the hoped-for advantages are largely 'nothing
ventured, nothing gained'.
Post by Roger
But not everybody is favorable, this article thinks it's all about tax
https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/freeports-in-post-brexit-br
itain-1-6171319
Here, I have to admit that the stated case against freeports seems
rather weak (repetitive claims of 'often provide facilities for money
laundering, tax evasion' etc - and other dodgy dealings). The other is a
reduction of workers' rights (although I don't see why this should
follow). Perhaps the more convincing is 'often simply moving prosperity
from one area to another'.
Post by Roger
Any which way, the man-in-the-street that you keep referring to is just
happy to try something new and is prepared to take the risk.
Yes - after consecutive governments' inability to minimise the decline
of the deprived areas (and especially the effects of the recession of
the late noughties, followed by the Tory's' insistence on applying more
and more austerity measures), many Brexiteers put 'just wanted change'
at the top of their list of reasons for wanting the EU. But will the
opening of freeports really make them (and the rest of us) better off
than if we had remained in the EU?
--
Ian
Roger
2020-01-09 15:43:45 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Ian Jackson
Yes - after consecutive governments' inability to minimise the decline
of the deprived areas (and especially the effects of the recession of
the late noughties, followed by the Tory's' insistence on applying more
and more austerity measures), many Brexiteers put 'just wanted change'
at the top of their list of reasons for wanting the EU. But will the
opening of freeports really make them (and the rest of us) better off
than if we had remained in the EU?
--
Ian
So can we put you on record as considering this a Unicorn?
Ian Jackson
2020-01-09 19:52:44 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Roger
Post by Ian Jackson
Yes - after consecutive governments' inability to minimise the decline
of the deprived areas (and especially the effects of the recession of
the late noughties, followed by the Tory's' insistence on applying more
and more austerity measures), many Brexiteers put 'just wanted change'
at the top of their list of reasons for wanting the EU. But will the
opening of freeports really make them (and the rest of us) better off
than if we had remained in the EU?
--
Ian
So can we put you on record as considering this a Unicorn?
We will have to wait and see if this particular Unicorn actually
materialises. It might turn out to be simply a donkey with a strapped-on
horn.
--
Ian
Roger
2020-01-09 20:14:36 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Roger
So can we put you on record as considering this a Unicorn?
We will have to wait and see if this particular Unicorn actually
materialises. It might turn out to be simply a donkey with a strapped-on
horn.
--
Ian
A donkey with a strapped on horn would be a pretty good description of post Maastricht Europe. Here's hoping this does better.....
Pamela
2020-01-10 13:51:50 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Roger
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Roger
So can we put you on record as considering this a Unicorn?
We will have to wait and see if this particular Unicorn actually
materialises. It might turn out to be simply a donkey with a
strapped-on horn.
--
Ian
A donkey with a strapped on horn would be a pretty good description of
post Maastricht Europe. Here's hoping this does better.....
It's reminiscent of "lions led by donkeys", with respect to false promises
from avid pro-Brexit politicians to an otherwise decent electorate.
Pamela
2020-01-08 15:19:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Roger
Post by Ian Jackson
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
Post by Pamela
Post by Pent
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on
31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Like his promise to increase police and nurse numbers it will
not even cover what was lost during austerity.
Boris said he was going to magic up 40 new hospitals.
no he didn't
He did no more than every other prospective candidate does
promise stuff that at some point in the future might materialise
As I have pointed out before, Wilson won the 1966 Hull by-election
by promising the Humber bridge
Wilson also promised to reverse the Beeching railway closures, and
then when in power did no such thing.
He had probably overlooked the fact that many of the closed lines had
been ripped up, some of the bridges they crossed demolished - and in
some locations buildings and roads constructed across their path.
Post by Keema's Nan
Post by tim...
that was magiced up in 1981, long after Wilson was out of power
tim
They are all lying toe-rags, and yet the sheep still seem hypnotised
by their every word.
Certainly 17.4 million succumbed to the promises about Brexit.
--
Ian
Just so we can get this on record, which are the promises which you
believe people 'Succumbed' to which you believe will not be met?
Out of interest, Roger, why don't you live in the UK? Isn't life here
good enough for you?
Pamela
2020-01-08 15:08:10 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by tim...
Post by Pamela
Post by Pent
Post by Pamela
"Boris Johnson promises a decade of prosperity".
Will Boris's propserity start the day after the UK leaves on 31st January?
What improvement, if any, will I notice?
Like his promise to increase police and nurse numbers it will not even
cover what was lost during austerity.
Boris said he was going to magic up 40 new hospitals.
no he didn't
He did no more than every other prospective candidate does
promise stuff that at some point in the future might materialise
As I have pointed out before, Wilson won the 1966 Hull by-election by
promising the Humber bridge
that was magiced up in 1981, long after Wilson was out of power
tim
That's why Boris's claim was such a blatant lie. It is more than usually
misleading, even by political standards, to say the government has:

"begun work on building 40 new hospitals across the country"

when in reality it has paid only for exploratory studies with no further
commitment to build a single thing.
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